The Tragedy of Albert E

Wouldn't you rather discuss someone else's work? No? I thought not, you don't change do you?

Posting up one's own cherried poems does seem a trifle bazaar, or am I in a cakey mirage?

A trifle bazaar? OK, I'll take two sherry and one plain.

Sean isn't bazaar or even bizarre, he's just a self-centred guy who can't see further than the end of his own pen, and he's been doing it ever since he arrived here many moons ago.

LOL Forgive me for trying not to die one more innovative individual unknown in his own lifetime.

Forgive you?

You have my eternal pity.

Aside from emphatically lacking the power of eternity, you have a bizzare and ineffective way of showing your pity. In reality, I see far beyond my pen, beyond monetary fish guts, beyond race, beyond the die roll of chance, and beyond quite a bit more. I have however, as is the trend of the time for moral and intelligent people, not been over-fortunate. Frankly, there's nothing rational or decent I could say that would be a response to your comments.

Aside from the fact that you can't spell, (I showed you how to spell 'bizarre', but as usual you take no notice of your betters), everybody lacks the power of eternity, though you challenge that all the time with your persistent efforts to thrust your poor writing in everyone's face.

You also fool yourself with your claims of morality and intelligence. You've been told before that it's not really acceptable to promote your own work on the forum, if it is any good, others would do that for you. Now why don't you take notice and concentrate on discussing the work of others, and you never know, they might just reciprocate.

I agree however that you haven't been fortunate, but rather cursed with the inability to see yourself as others do. I also agree there's nothing rational you could say in reponse to my post as you're not a rational person. It's not necessary to SHOW pity, I just feel it, in increasing quantities!

Basically, Misisipi is fostering a TV Court atmosphere, not a thoughtful forum. Occasionally bringing pieces of my work to the attention of the ABC tales community is no rudeness. I did so in the hope that somebody might benefit from and appreciate them. If nobody responds to a post, it fades away.

Now in response to your personal comments, I'll point out that over the years numerous people(including the site editors) have excitedly brought up my work on this very forum. Secondly, Shakespeare would often spell the same word three ways in one play. While I don't try to follow suit, precise spelling is not exactly the soul of creativity.

Highlighting your own works so that people can "benefit from and appreciate them"....?

Not to learn anything about your self/ your writing?

Blimey, I _am_ in a trifle bazaar. Can I have two trifles please?

* Occasionally bringing pieces of my work to the attention of the ABC tales community *

Yes, but they are the ONLY pieces you EVER bring to anyone's attention.

* ..have excitedly brought up my work .. *

I can see how regurgitating your work might be exciting, though better not to swallow it in the first place.

Re Spelling etc. Shakespeare is excused on the basis that he was a genius. You however, are not.

I thought you were over-fortunate for once to get a cherry for that poem Sean, not that it was bad in itself but a disregard for rules of capitalisation and punctuation woul have disqualified it for me. But what do you expect from bean-counters turned poets?

As for my choices in punctuation and capitalization, I do know the standard rules; I have a B.A. in English and Literature from Southern Oregon University. As far as following the poetry of other members of my e-communities, I've been far from perfect. However, when somebody shows a consistent interest in my poetry, I always read and try to dig some of theirs... almost always with success.
Then I have huge gratitude for everyone who makes ABC Tales possible. SALAWM (arabic for peace)

Oh, I see now. You only put yourself out if someone shows consistent interest in YOU first !

A pity USO didn't teach you any social graces, though if you're a good example of their English Lang & Lit degrees, I guess you already have those. If you know the standard rules, (whether for English or life), perhaps it would be wise to follow them.

TESTICLES (English for bollocks)

"If nobody responds to a post, it fades away."

That's not necessarily true. I put up a portion of my novel around two years ago. I didn't post a link to it, and it didn't receive a cherry award until about a month ago. Files may age but words never die.

I agree with Neil Mc on the capitalisation. You can bend the rules in poetry but you have to do so consistently. This seems totally random, is off-putting and just looks lazy.

As for the poem, it is okay, not my usual cup of tea. I don't get all the historical references, which may say something about me rather than the poem. For example, if I wanted to say something about pleasure as the highest goal, I'd try and do it in a slightly more interesting way than throwing in a reference to the Epicureans. Using the Epicureans' garden to get the reader to think about pleasure is a bit like using the word 'Sanskrit' to get the reader to think about language. (see gen diss forum!)

I did quite like the second stanza though especially the 'the quiet mathematics of mouse stalking'

jude

"Cacoethes scribendi"
http://www.judesworld.net

Jude never seems to have a bad word to say about anyone. Unlike _others_ on here. Bless her cottons.

Hey, this is fun. Who needs to read any of the posts when there's the forums for entertainment?

Well, Epicurus is a rather misunderstood thinker, and one whose ideas I feel are extremely relevant to this age. He was not an advocate of immoderate pleasure. Perhaps above all, he recommended thoughtful retreat from the mainstream world. This was my reference: A person with Einstein's abilities could have made a quiet, productive way in the world without sharing dangerous ideas with a society unready to peacably mangage them.
a.b., no disrespect, but I didn't make this post for TV court entertainment. I simply wanted to share a piece of literature which I labored to create.
Salawm (arabic for Peace)

Actually, it should read "Salaam" as the 'a' is lengthened in the back of the throat, unlike 'aw' which is a more nasally-derived vowel-sound. The more correct way to say it would be 'Salaam aleikum' (Peace be with you). Nice poem btw.

ArcherGirl, having many Saudi friends at Portland State University, I'm aware of the correct pronunciation of their word for "Peace." I'm also aware that the quickest way to impart an approximate pronunciation to a reader is: "Salawm"
Now, how about them Dodgers, or the price of rabbit feed in Bangladesh, or... that poem about Einstein?

I'm afraid I'm with Neil and Jude on this one, the random capitalisation and lack of punctuation ruled out a cherry from me (good for you that they are subjective eh?) I also find the flagging of your own piece rather self-centred as I have yet to see you flag anyone elses.
However, having just completed an English degree myself I am quite interested to hear your reasons for disregarding the 'standard' rules, do you not see that it makes what could be a reasonable poem seem shoddy and amateurish?

I'm generally quite happy with no caps at all. I sometimes do that myself.

The random caps thing is annoying from the reader's point of view but not all poets care very much about the reader.

The poem is the usual stuff that Sean writes. As Missi says, he been writing similar things for a long time.

"ArcherGirl, having many Saudi friends at Portland State University, I'm aware of the correct pronunciation of their word for "Peace.""

I don't think the Saudis own the word, Sean. And I don't think they pronounce it your way in Leicester.

I don't mind no caps at all but this is more than just annoying, I don't think it helps the poet communicate.

Why does Newton get a capital but poor old Aristotle doesn't? Seeing them so close together makes me think this must be deliberate; this must signify something; but I'm damned if I can work out what the heck it is!

Is there a reason for this Sean and I'm just being dumb?

I'm not going to respond to inquiries from people who call me things like "self-centred," though otherwise I'd be happy to. For the record, I have flagged a number of poems, including one by Archergirl, and rebuffed an individual who often flagged mine when he he made an anti-semitic comment(I'm not Jewish.)

If you look at my writing with an open mind, you'll see that much of it is very thoughtful, carefully crafted, and joyously reflects the spirit of this age's youth. And of course, some of it's slapdash, mediocre, etc.

I will, as Poetjude's been nice enough, comment on why I gave Newton a capital and not Aristotle. I basically try to reserve capitals for emphasis, as I believe Dickensen did in the actual manuscripts. A key-board is too limited an instrument of expression to follow restrictions on its use. In my opinion, requiring the active thought of the reader is just what separates poetry from prose... though of course that's a matter of degree, not nature.

So my not capitalizing Aristotle isn't any sort of dismissal of an intellectual who's had a mammoth impact on the world. Incidentally, though, the now obscure Epicurus was more renowned among the ancient Greeks and with myself. Though I don't admire Newton, I feel he looms large as a symbol of laboratory-limited science and wanton technocracy.

Salaawm,

Sean

Anyone know the correct arabic pronounciation of ' tosser'?

Sean Nelson?

I agree cath_carr. Blaming the keyboard and/or the reader for unwelcome interpretations of one's poem does seem a little lame. Adam Phillips said something like "We are not misunderstood: we are just understood in ways we don't like". He's right.

I would agree with seannelson that name-calling is not exactly constructive criticism. His reasons for not punctuating a certain way are valid enough; who writes the rules of poetry, after all? That it doesn't conform to the eye or preferences of others is rather beside the point, as Bukharin notes.

However, sean, you shouldn't post your work up if you have trouble with others' reactions to it. It's a 'head above the turret' risk you take, and this *is* a public forum, not a love-in!

His head and ego are so large they won't lower below the turret! 'Name calling' as you describe it is subjective. He dislikes being called 'self-centred' because it offends his view of himself, (check out the superlatives he uses to describe his own work), those that use the phrase do so because that is EXACTLY how they see him. It isn't name calling, but justified and accurate description.

You're all mis-understanding me... but thankfully, some of you are doing so in a Civilized, intelligent way! "I'm well aware" should be my motto. I'm aware that I flagged my own poem and this isn't high etiquette. I'm also aware that this is a public forum where random people say whatever they feel like.

I could do the same, subtly or directly. But why? I simply want to share beautiful and Peaceful poetry. I take creating my poetry seriously... and I've found Numerous readers on numerous websites. I write poetic, political letters to the editors of various newspapers; For the latter, I've made my way onto the Bush administration's no-fly list, though I've never mentioned violence.

And if I'm a little self-promotional, I'm not an egotist talking to hear my own voice. I'm for re-distributing wealth around the world, getting back to nature, and Cultivating peace and humaternity whenever possible. I'm just one poetic wave in the great Rising tide of liberty!

I don't work in a bank and spend my days obeying some authoritarian, or spend ten minutes picking out a fashionable outfit. I'm a wild Man and I'm comfortable with this! I read and write poetry that engages me with the world... not protects me from it. I just lived in rural Thailand for six months, feasting and living with farmers and fisher-folk. If I were in England, I'd be paling around with cockneys and working people.

So basically, in response to all this criticism: I Don't Care!!

{ I simply want to share beautiful and Peaceful poetry. I take creating my poetry seriously... and I've found Numerous readers on numerous websites. }

Mmmmmm, Love the Random Capitalisation in your post just There ^

There is no reason for it in your Poem either is There? It was An accident wasn't it?
Well done. The First rule of literature is to Bluff your way through.
You can't fool all of the people all of the time alas.

Still, the debate is keeping your poem (small p) at the rop of the forum . Yay for you!

my, my what a surprise, archergirl defending someone who flagged up one of her stories once upon a time, would you Adam and Eve it?

By the way Mr _America's next greatest writer_ , if I were you I would have taken self-centred as a compliment, there are sure a load more names that I could think of that are much more fitting and not only the 'tosser' that has already been mentioned. I would suggest a return to education and this time try to pay attention in class, (you may also consider asking for a refund cos believe me I know 6-7 year olds with a better grasp of grammar and punctuation than yourself!)

Shouldn't that be tosser with a capital T?

"Mr. America's next greatest writer?" You said it; I sure as heck never did. I'm very happy with what I've accomplished in creative writing; It's been a long path of hard work. I don't want fame or riches; I just wanna chill in the garden with the good Samaritan epicureans.
But I really get disgusted with how slow so many people are to open their hearts and minds! That's why all these people like Buddha, Christ, and Socrates have been necessary. It's why mythology is full of dragons hoarding jewels, because people don't want to admit that it's they who pass Lazarus every day. As Jes. said, it's the inside of the cup that should be kept clean, not the outside. As Bob Marley said,

"we should really love each other,
instead we're fussing and fighting,
like we ain't supposed to do."

And I don't care what you call me. It's petty, meaningless. Pigeons will shat and dogs will have their day.

Oh, Saggy love, still moping in your dreary fag-stunk bedsit? I don't need to 'defend' seannelson; he's doing well enough on his own. I *do*, however, appreciate his attitude, which, unlike yours, is at least open and honest. If he wants to punctuate a certain way, so what? That he flagged a poem of mine once upon a time is irrelevant, as are your opinions...

*raspberry*

* ..You're all mis-understanding me.. *

No,no,no! It's YOU that doesn't understand.

You're an egotistical fucking bore. Now what part of that don't YOU understand?

* ..I simply want to share beautiful and Peaceful poetry... *

If that's the case why do you insist on banging on about your own?

Dear me you yanks really do have your heads so incredibly far up your own arses, Sean isn't being 'open and honest' just seriously deluded about his own talent and worth, other people are just saying it how it is, his writing, punctuation etc is shit! Is that open and honest enough for YOU frizzhead?

"I don't work in a bank and spend my days obeying some authoritarian, or spend ten minutes picking out a fashionable outfit."

I suggest you have a go, it would probably make your writing a hell of a lot more interesting.

I'm new to abctales.
Is it always this unfriendly and shouty here? Only if it is I think I'm going to go away again.

Hi cj and welcome, it does often get rather loud round these parts, the best way to deal with posts you don't like is to simply ignore them. That said it's not real life, just an alternate cyberworld where highly strung artist types post and debate on every subject imaginable. Stick around for a while, post some stories and have a read of others, the forums aren't the be all and end all of ABC!

'If I were in England, I'd be paling around with cockneys and working people.'

I can't stop laughing. Really, that's the funniest thing I've seen in months... I can't believe I missed it the first time. Ha ha ha gor blimey guvnor etc.

Welcome cj, camus is right.

Thanks for the welcome and the inside info, camus. I think I'm going to tread pretty warily here. If I were on the receiving end of some of the stuff I've read here I think my confidence would be irreparably damaged.
Cheers.

It is true, cj, that these forums are not for the weak-hearted or the thin-skinned. The best advice is to not take *anything* said on here, no matter how egregiously wrong or insulting or ridiculous, personally.

Saggy, my hair *is* frizzy; I use all sorts of products to keep it smooth, but, alas, it has a mind of its own. Thanks for noticing. No doubt you were glaring at my photo in envy of my stunning and incandescent beauty. I know, dear, it has that effect on many people.

Yanks don't necessarily have their heads up their arses; what we *do* have is a culture of self-assertion and stating one's achievements (no matter how dubious). It is the polar opposite to the very British self-deprecation, where one is not allowed to be proud, nor state that one is proud, of anything they do, less they be thought of as unseemly. Pip pip!

'If I were in England, I'd be paling around with cockneys and working people.'

It's important not to confuse the two.

*runs away*

LOL!

"It is the polar opposite to the very British self-deprecation, where one is not allowed to be proud, nor state that one is proud, of anything they do, less they be thought of as unseemly."

This is right, up to a point, about British culture in general but personally I quite like brash, self-assured people when they really are good at what they do.

From that point of view, I think we have something to learn from... er... you guys!

The problem is that Sean demonstrates the 'culture of self-assertion' at its worst (at least, for the person doing the self-asserting).

The more he tries to explain himself, the more he gives the impression that he's a strereotypical American deluded buffoon. His heart may in the right place but the one-liners are irresistable:

"It's why mythology is full of dragons hoarding jewels, because people don't want to admit that it's they who pass Lazarus every day. " Come on!

"You're an egotistical fucking bore." - Misisipi

"The more he tries to explain himself, the more he gives the impression that he's a strereotypical American deluded buffoon." - bukharin etc.

"Dear me you yanks really do have your heads so incredibly far up your own arses, ... his writing, punctuation etc is shit!" - saggyhair

Talk about some eloquent, cultured one-liners. I would never judge the English people by this bullocks. The only reason I've even been wasting my energy on this thread is that I'm ill and housebound... and thus have time on my hands. Thanks, Archergirl, for your kind words on a thread where I'm so unpopular; It shows character.
As Ghandi encouraged, I've given up the need to defend myself. "I" am not of much importance. What importance my writing has stems from the lessons I've labored to learn, like a fisherman or a milk-maid, from the larger world, and from the long labor of word-smithing.
I leave you with an old African proverb:
"When the grass is cut, the snakes will show." The same goes for tossers.

* "When the grass is cut, the snakes will show." The same goes for tossers *

How else did we spot you?

* . what we *do* have is a culture of self-assertion and stating one's achievements (no matter how dubious). It is the polar opposite to the very British self-deprecation, where one is not allowed to be proud,... *

Well that's maybe how YOU'D like to see it but others see it differently.

What some Americans have is an irrestible urge to exaggerate every detail of their 'achievements' in the hopes of impressing those around them. You're completely wrong about the British not allowing themselves pride, they just don't generally feel the need to keep shouting about it. They also don't feel so inferior as to keep bragging about things that Brits take for granted, which is one of the reasons that YOUR constant bragging, rather than boosting your street cred among Brits, makes you look a complete idiot and exposes your lack of self-esteem.

It's people like Nelson that give Americans a bad name.

Oh, whew, for a minute there I thought you were referring to me, Missi.

As far as arrogance goes, I would say, "Let ye who is without sin cast the first stone." There's not one amongst us who is innocent; this forum reeks of cultural and moral superiority, and it's not just the Yanks who are guilty. So give it a rest with the witch-hunt, why don't you.

First of all, I'll bet Britain has some braggarts of one sort or another. And I know there are many Americans who are quite accomplished and humble.
Though I confess that I'm only the former, the main reason I've been talking about myself in this forum has been to respond to various insults without participating in a feces throwing contest.
I will point out that these "insults" have been quite lacking in rhetorical skill and wit. They're not even fit for a decent bar... or pub, as the British call it.
Not that it matters much, but I don't value any patriotism beyond a limited and wholesome pride in one's region or culture. And as an admirer of Arabic culture, a socialist, and a long-time environmentalist, I'm not quite the poster child for what rational world citizens dislike about recent happenings in America.

Sorry if I sounded flippant, dismissive or trivialising with my 'entertainment' comment, Sean. That wasn't what I meant. I was just struck by how animated people had become over the issue. Comments on it seemed to be the main things being posted on ABC for a while!

"First of all, I'll bet Britain has some braggarts of one sort or another. And I know there are many Americans who are quite accomplished and humble."

That's not the point. There's a cultural difference (and a fairly big one) in methods of expression.

I'm not making a moral judgement either way. Self-deprication can often be just as annoying as self-assertion.

If Sean genuinely can't understand I find this kind of thing:
"What importance my writing has stems from the lessons I've labored to learn, like a fisherman or a milk-maid, from the larger world, and from the long labor of word-smithing."
very funny and others find it very annoying, I think these kinds of discussions are going to keep happening.

* ...there are many Americans who are quite accomplished and humble.
Though I confess that I'm only the former... *

Oh dear, he's made a confession!

The only things you're accomplished in are conceit and self-publicity.

You *can*, according to the rules, post links to your own work and ask for feedback. But you're not supposed to do it for purely promotional purposes. It's not a matter of etiquette. It's abusing the forums.

"I will point out that these "insults" have been quite lacking in rhetorical skill and wit."

Who are you to judge? You don't demonstrate any rhetorical skill or wit yourself. Plus, no one is trying to be particularly witty - what they're all trying to get at is The Truth. And the truth is that your estimation of yourself and your own achievements is far above the reality. Your manner *is* obnoxious and self-important. Your poetry isn't 'beautiful'. It's competent, in parts, but could use improvement in others.

You know why humility is valued so much? Because a humble person readily admits their failings, and admitting there's room for improvement is the first step to actually improving. You're refusal to admit that you've done anything wrong, and your rebuffing of all criticism of your poetry and manner is preventing you from getting any better. And you do need to get better - a whole lot better - if you don't want to die having never produced anything of note.

~

I'll Show You Tyrants * Fuselit * The Prowl Log * Woe's Woe

Alan, no offense in the world! With only text to judge, it's often hard to discern people's tone.
Earlier, I wrote: "I am not of much importance. What importance my writing has stems from the lessons I've labored to learn, like a fisherman or a milk-maid, from the larger world, and from the long labor of word-smithing." Bukharin and his ilk on this forum dismiss that as quite humorous.
Well, my statement reflects socialist values I share with "the best people" across the world. A writer should be a friend and servant of the great, creative masses.
Now, I'm not going to waste my time rebutting one after another of these trite, Insipid comments. I will say that if the ABC Tales staff want to remove this thread, I think that would be best. It would make room for some sort of literary discussion.

boy people, I left the discuss writing forum a few days and what have i come back to? Is this really such a big deal? In fact, why is everyone still arguing over the issue? If you keep insulting each other it's not gonna stop, and I think it's obvious you're not going to change sean or alan or missi or saggy or archer or anyone elses opinions by getting in a childish argument with them. Everyone has stated their opinion of Sean's work yet he doesn't seem accept the crit, is that some sign to keep telling him your opinion?

LOL! 'From the mouths of babes...'

Well said, Mike. Well said!

I want to point out that I haven't insulted anybody... only their commments. I'm aware that's a fine distinction but it holds. That doesn't mean that I'm trying to make up with anybody; I'm so offended that I couldn't honestly accept an apology from any one of these people. (I'm in quite ill health.)
Courtesy is actually a value that's close to my heart. As Confucius said, "Courtesy is next to morality." And I'm aware that I'm discourteous by flagging my own work on this forum.
But I have such compelling reasons for sharing my work that it outweighs the consideration like a stone does a feather. But it'll be a long time before I flag any more of my work on this forum; I am a drunken jester at times, but I'm not the clown they paint me as.

What we have here is a car crash ladies and gentlemen. People just can't help taking a peek. This must be the ABCtales version of Big Brother or some other carcrash TV the public so so enjoy; it has the biggest hit to be seen in a while. Tusk, tusk, where should our allegiance lie? With the housebound ill Mr Nelson and Archer Girl or the masses (who must know best because they are the masses)??
Sean you are annoying blowing your own trumpet; it is unseemly. But given your condition and situation it is perhaps understandable. And it is all down to a matter of wording dear boy. Instead of telling us how good it is, post it up and ask for opinions (you perhaps thought you were already doing this - nah!)
I can't help feeling there is a lot history here - if you know what I mean. All that has needed to be said has been said - the point made!
Whichever way you look at it, it just becomes another distraction we can do without. This site is about learning and improvement (work and self) and keeping your hand in (I think), even the forums are used to keep the wits sharpened and to let off steam. If you already know it ALL and are SO good - f*** off and get published; and stick your fingers up in a proper way.
'it is nice to be important, but more important to be nice' (vomit!) that must be one of those american sayings - yuk yuk yuk - chill out and have a good day writing something worthy of your individual talents.
Respect to you all.
skinsen

**************** J A S P E R B L A S T E R ****************

Thanks louisecypher for putting me straight (I assume you refer to me in the above, hard to tell amid the ranting) But my my what anger! Not much respect for recently berieved people either, not nice. You read my post wrong I think (I apologise to sean if he does too). hey ho. Hate to think i was contributing in a negative way to the frenzy. Just pointing out (obviously in a bad way) the negative voyeuristic effects this thread was having - sorry, grovel grovel -
I guess your intention not too honourable either but merely to aggitate, hence the pseudonim on pseudonim hey, louis? - louise? - jasper? - whatever.
I reiterate - chill out and have a good day writing something worthy of your talents.
Take it easy ;)

Skinsen, you seem like a quite reasonable fellow and I respect you. But, as is the nature of internet forums, we can't understand each other and the myriad experiences that form us. My poetry has the potential, at least, to be a significant force in the liberation and improvement of the world. So I've never given much of a fuck about courtesy on this forum (there is a history, dang my gosh!!...) my vision extends as far as the American plains in that I want to aid the burgeoning vitality of Gaiaa, or the world.

I've been a fool, too; It was only a few years ago that I gave some credence to the idea of "white supremacy," not that I was ever active. In highschool(14-18,) I had a small and ignorant fascination with Nazi Germany, primarily for the reason that it was so taboo.

Though I note some exscuse in the authoritarian nature of my American educational system, I revile any such pro-Nazi expressions; I repeat, I loathe any sympathy with the Nazism of World War II. I'm also disgusted with those elements, including the American government and unnamed Others, that so burdened the people of Germany that they were deaf to the evil of the Fascist/ Nazi regime.

In that spirit, Jasper(if Louise is indeed you,) leave me alone! I'm not insulting you, but your anti-semitic comment of long-ago forbids me from accepting any aid from your quarter. (I'm not a percent Jewish that I have any knowledge of.) I was also at a point in my development racist... but I will no longer in any form ally myself with any form of division along the lines of ethnicity.

Mis., Buk. Jack. , etc., don't think I have any more toleration for your VULGAR behavior. I simply value the word and genius of "civil!" If my ally isn't Jasper, you've absolutely just attracted your own level of expression.

**************** J A S P E R B L A S T E R ****************

apologies for giving the tosser a second posting

"My poetry has the potential, at least, to be a significant force in the liberation and improvement of the world."

Please stop this.

No no no - please dont stop. I LOVE it, it's absolutely brilliant.

Dear lord I often find I am capable and possibly too eager to write some of the most appalling flannel, and on the whole one gets a jolly joust from it; but my mouth wank aside, to simply peer across and read some of these other forums is delightful and not in the least bit inspiring. Strange how would be scribblers clamber and scramble into these sites; pause artistically, take a deep breath then lambaste anyone who has the indecency of writing anything of any merit or lack! Each diminutive electric penned lizard frothing at the mouth with the earnest intention in destroying some other persons scribbling dreams; if sean nelson wants to heal the world with his deliberate illiteracy then I say good luck to him - of you pop sunshine; however that said is it more farcical that he truly believes this or that others feel the need to attack his folly. Who wins out of that relationship, the folly maker or those who make folly of folly – madness but thoroughly gripping stuff – HURRAH!

Mr Cade
please.... you ask 'Who are you to juge?' and then....
'And the truth is that your estimation of yourself and your own achievements is far above the reality. Your manner *is* obnoxious and self-important. Your poetry isn't 'beautiful'. It's competent, in parts, but could use improvement in others.'
Play fair you cops!
The Lone Groover
P.S.
"The writer is a spiritual anarchist, as in the depth of his soul every man is. He is discontented with everything and everybody. The writer is everybody's best friend and only true enemy - the good and great enemy. He neither walks with the multitude nor cheers with them. The writer who is a writer is a rebel who never stops."
William Saroyan 1958

First of all, everybody has a right to their opinion regarding my poetry, or whether I should have posted it. Where I take issue with a certain group here... is their foul and bullying manner of expression. It's not that hard to figure out what kind of people you're dealing with when they start ripping into your nationality as well as yourself. Personally, I think much of the wealth of America, Britain, Europe, Saudi Arabia, Israel, etc., should be re-distributed to the third world. I figure there will be fewer terrorists if there are fewer humans on the globe who are terrified of starvation and epidemic.
I regret having been obligated to brush away Jasper's support, but I thought it best. I'm not that concerned about my personal status on this internet forum with a bunch of people I don't know from Adam's left mule; Rather, I'm trying to discuss certain ideas in a logical and humane way. I am, just in case, accepting apologies.

And I thought Trump had a big ego.

I'd retract that last line sean less you're hoping to be castrated on the forums.

Your conceit, ego and sheer arrogance are staggering, Nelson. You do however. share one thing with your more talented and famous namesake, you're half blind.

Can't you get it through your thick head that no one gives a fuck about your poetry? Mainly because you keep telling us how great it is and it's going to save the world. As Jon said, it's nothing more than competent at best.

Get your head out of your arse and you may just start to get the messages.

Sometimes eloquent language is a waste of time and you're a case in point, it only encourages you more, hence the blunt turn of phrase that leaves nothing to the imagination. In short, you are a fucking pest, don't you have something better to attend to, like improving your writing?

For what it's worth, YOUR persistence in flagging your own work amounts to insidious bullying, so stop bleating about those that reciprocate in kind.

You've got about as much chance of receiving an apology from anyone as your poetry has of changing the world; ie. NONE!

"It's not that hard to figure out what kind of people you're dealing with when they start ripping into your nationality as well as yourself."

The point that there are cultural differences between British and American people isn't 'ripping into your nationality'.

In my case, it was an attempt to explain why some of us find your 'self-assertion' either humourous or annoying, and you're unable to understand why you generate this reaction.

As I've said already, I think in some instances the generally American tendency for people to state their opinions and talk about their abilities in an open way can be a really good thing and can lead to benefits for others.

The problem is when there's a big gap between someone's estimation of themselves and their abilities.

"I've been a fool, too; It was only a few years ago that I gave some credence to the idea of "white supremacy," not that I was ever active."

Well, that pretty much explains everything! You may have given up on being a Nazi, but apparently, the accompanying self-righteous certainty, lack of tolerance (or 'toleration', to use your vocab) toward differing opinions, scant regard for others' feelings, lack of logic, humility or self-awareness are all still a part of your personality.

Put yourself in our place, Sean. Imagine, some kid comes up to you, thrusts a pile of soggy paper into your hand and says, "Look at my art! It's going to change the world! I am a genius!" You turn your attention to the paper, only to find it's the torn out pages from a German recipe book, stuck together with blood! You tell him, but he ignores you, and keeps dogging you, shouting, "It's concept art! I have a great vision! I am going to be a powerful influence on the future!" You tell him to stop it, and he starts shouting abuse at you. Would you show 'toleration' to such behaviour?

Have you thought of workshopping your poetry, so that you can improve and maybe have something published one day? Then you'll get some readers.

~

I'll Show You Tyrants * Fuselit * The Prowl Log * Woe's Woe

LOL. I'm not intimidated by you anymore than I was by the 10-year old schoolyard bully whose fingers I gave a good twisting(he later got me the same way.) i Desire to at some point here record my unconventional atheism, which respects the certainty of aliens and the definite possibilites of such things as telepathy and tele-kinesis.
I have to refute some of this ''J. -adeian" nonsense or well-meaning people could actually buy into it. See, it takes courage to openly admit your worst thoughts(ones you never acted on) to a group that's hostile to you. But to demonstrate my developed consciousness to discerning people, I did so. And I can do it without prostrating myself because I've since travelled to Thailand and put my life on the line for peasants of another ethnicity, shared my room with a homeless old American black man, etc. By the way, the arrogant actions of the British Empire were a major factor in Creating nazi Germany and your adherence to the latter is similar to my long out-grown intellectual state, fostered by English authors like Joseph Conrad and Shakespeare, who I still admire greatly.

And as far as these accusations of egotism go, my first response is that I'm a high-functioning autistic(a common road to freakish accomplishments such as Mozart's music,) and that this is quite a different phenomenon from the egotism of millionaires like Donald Trump(as a fervent socialist, I couldn't really object to some fifteen centimeters more than the removal of Trump's bad hair.) In continuance, individuals on this forum(such as Skinsen) could probably teach me a lot about sociality.

But, if treated with a dismissive attitude, I'm morally unable to access such helpful teachings. And, for those trying to somehow intimidate me over the internet, you'll have about as much luck as the Liliputians attempting to tyrannize a loose Gulliver.

You know, I feel like continuing so I suppose I will. The great thing about being a truly accomplished person is that I don't need(and to speak "British," would really rather not be subjected to) your approval in the least Liliputian bit, Jack Cade and reactionist ilk. No, I'm not widely published in conventional literary magazines, though I do have a couple such publications. But that's because I've been so busy running my maniac guerilla operation on the internet that I haven't applied to such magazines for at least a couple years. Also, I've been busy contributing my literary skills to green-socialist politics, which has landed me on The Empire of America's "no-fly-list."

Lastly, just to turn you "green," I have a socialist hook in a major publishing house just waiting for a book-length manuscript, which will probably be a kids' book, fitting my level of discipline(notice the university-certified punctuation and grammar; I could that at the age of 10 but I've been striving for a little more.)

In finality, notice that all of the vulgar or in American, "cuss," words, have been used by my detractors and NEVER by myself. Although I suppose some of my initial reactions are ANGRY enough to ignite another suicide bomb or so, I've victoriously funneled them through the Beautiful process of Civil Rezistance, in a small imitative fashion of M.L. King, that admirer of baseball player Jackie Robinson, who lies ahead of me in my voyage of Discovery.

(I should add that all your S-talk, while it would be uproariously laughed at in an american Pub, would at least be free of King Claudiush COWARDICE!!!)