Let's Start Again: The Book

hi ScoZen, all ;) i think that is a great idea. Hopefully it will happen.

keep writing
keep smiling :)

Hello Prettyrose.
Thanks for a comment on this.
And well done on your comp cherry.

ps "...Hopefully it will happen..."
I hope so, fingers x

Scozen / Prettyrose and those who have e-mailed me directly:

Tony is far too busy to take this on himself.

I am presently looking at the possibility of producing a book via my ABCtales Magazine account with lulu.com.

It depends initially on whether enough prize-winners and competition entrants actually want to be published in this way.

Then it depends on whether I have the time and inclination.

Lastly, it depends on whether sufficient numbers wish to buy a copy to make it a viable proposition.

I would like to see more expressions of interest before I commit myself.

How much would it be likely to cost? For a single copy of the book, I mean. I'll buy one, of course, but I think price might be a major concern to some. Any estimates?

By producing and selling such a book would any income accrue? Would ABCtales benefit?

Price depends on many factors.

As a rough guide, according to lulu's book price calculator, a 100 page, A5 page size, black and white paperback would have a production cost of about £2.99 (not including P&P, of course).

To generate income, I could place a mark-up on the price (out of which lulu also takes a cut).

From my experience with the Magazine, this estimate sounds a bit low, but should certainly be less than a fiver.

(As an aside, I presently place a small mark-up on the Magazine of about a £1 in order to recoup the cost of buying a proof copy for myself. At the moment, I am still running at a loss. Which is one reason why I would like to gauge the level of interest.)

I really don't know how publishing works.
I just assumed that any ABCtaler's interested to see their work in print would go along with what you suggest.
Another perhaps, incorrect assumption was that some of the money generated, a donation went an ABC chosen charity?
I would certainly buy a copy.
Hope this helps.
Brian.

What you have to bear in mind is that there is no creative kudos in being included in what would essentially be a 'vanity' publication.

Writers may prefer to hold back their work for submission to a more 'professional' market.

From experience, the number of copies sold is likely to be less than the number of contributors.

Without a substantial mark-up, the money generated would frankly be peanuts.

WilkyBarkid said:"At the moment, I am still running at a loss. Which is one reason why I would like to gauge the level of interest."
So let me get this clear: is he bearing the cost of production? Is it an individual enterprise and not one run by ABC or on its behalf?

The Magazine is a one-man enterprise.

It is sanctioned by Tony Cook as a promotional tool for ABCtales.com, but I receive no input either editorially or financially.

(Though I should mention that Tony has offered to cover any up-front costs for the proposed book.)

I run it on a not-for-profit basis and seek only to break even, now that I also make it available in hard copy.

You may have noticed that I also do not use it for self-promotion.

If it were designed to be a money-making enterprise, then my approach would have to be quite different. In fact, I probably wouldn't be the best person to have at the helm.

I wasn't questioning your motives, WilkyBarkid and I accept you are not self-promoting.
I only wanted to know whether there was any financial benefit to ABC, which is what members I believe would wish. You made it clear that it is used only as a promotional tool. Like ScoZen I don't know anything about publishing but I deduce one simple fact: if ABC does not benefit and you are not even breaking even, the only ones who stand to make any profit are Lulu.
Is that what we want?

I suppose it depends on whether financial benefit is your only or main yardstick by which to measure the potential 'worth' of this proposed venture.

I'm sure most people just want a nice souvenir to display on their bookshelf or coffee table.

As it stands, a print-on-demand service is the most economical to employ as it involves no substantial set-up costs, apart from my time.

If there were a guaranteed readership of at least 50 people, then it might be cheaper to have a limited print run. But I don't fancy running the risk of having a box-full of unsold volumes stuffed under my bed.

Advertising and promoting the book to a wider clientele beyond the ABCtales community would also be cost prohibitive. Attracting advertising revenue that Tony would find ethically acceptable would take considerable time, effort and expertise, especially if it were to be sustainable.

This sounds like I'm making it problematic. The bottom line is: if there's demand for a book, I can make one available.

I'm about to go on a short holiday. Please continue this debate in my absence and I'll bow to the will of the site members on my return.

Hi ScoZen, :) Thank you for the congrats, that means alot.

And Yes hopefully one way or another we can get entries and others done so everything crosses he he x

Keep Smiling :)

Hi Guys :) After reading your comments and confess to not knowing much abut how its run and financially managed on Abctales, I can however see now fully why Wilkybarkid (enjoy your holiday) :),is apprehensive, sorry fully discussing all sides.

I think like in the ideas I and now others have discussed, if we were going to do any kind of 'own publicizing' for our work or ABCtales it would be various items that would appeal to young, mature, middle age and that will be cost effective for all including the ones buying and so ABCtales and others who deserve recognition and funds get it.

When I suggested items for our work to be put on, those that wish to allow their work to been seen or heard in this way, for me it was about us as a team and the forgotten ones publishers wont touch until agent or through well known others, so I hoped if a lot agreed and we did do it, then we would be in it together from scratch to end. But like Wilkybarkid rightly pointed out, everything has to be picked at so we all know what is involved in this and other enterprises we may think of.

I was trying to start a business when recession hit, and how I had gone about generating interest e.t.c for my business was market research first, I asked my family, friends, strangers if they would buy my product and how much they pay e.t.c, has we all know I am sure, that way you know if your product even has a chance and go from there.

But from a mere amateur writer to a person who loves our Abctales community if I can help I will has I think its about time ones that do want to heard and seen, don't get forgotten and lost in a society of 'it people' and greed. I think with so many diverse ways to get ourselves or ABCtales noticed more, there is, the potential is unlimited. But like any adventure in life there is risks,but it's amazing what a group of people could do if they want too.

Sorry got in to my speech mode again hehehe.

Keep Writing
Keep Smiling

:)))

new WilkyBarKid (Letter)
and ScoZen's idea.
Hello!
Just seen the debate going on, 'Let's
Start Again' Book maybe. I think it is
a great idea, we do not get anything for
nothing in this world, maybe a VOTE first list could be done of how many like to buy first, and any
donations be given. We alway's buy what we want!
be it top make, or cheap,things get my meaning and pay. Pop star's. Ticket's high price. £20-up to £30 Or Theatre's now, game box. True I am a pensioner.
But must say. The Magazine 23 Editor thanks, brilliant, Glossy cover, titles, photos, set out. "12x8" over 30 pages. The time given, names headings punctuated for me, not cut down! or altered.
and typed of all Author's in it and photo sent, consent for £7.99p was a true! bargain,colour's. Photos of all, small biography all,
listed superbly. full of the poems and stories. Course all new one's that are coming on all, feel out of this world if put in any book. Or pocket size
but hard to see so well. Mags' are brilliant.
Good job we don't have to pay, £5 each time put one on, some publisher's charge £14.99 each. I had four not anymore. But would willingly pay afee! weekly on here.
AbcTales. Editor's do not get paid. I used to go,all
shop's now can then, sell my draw tickets church at,to most of shops walking? different roads @ £1 a time book if 5 sold one goes free. Make £2oo or £300 for homeless at church I went then, I could only do families at first Gobsmacked.Priest wopuld say,can you do more mentally I did and prizes, and work out money, and list it all.
But a KEEP SAKE forever. for a book on AbcTales. It is.
But to read other author's works,
and mine in was amazing.
All beautifully arranged.
Stories and poems, of all different interesting things, by the authors. Keep sake for life. When and if buy Books library or shop rare to see picture's in and have pay more if so.
in cost £7.99p up to £14.99. and much more. No picture's photos. I was absolutely delighted. Well Big Issue sell now £2 a time £1 goes to them.
Once a leaflet came by post? Do it all, so many word's had to work it all out,paid £14.99 a time,one in among other's still write want other's of course by title, but asked pay again £14.99 each time,want just for one to be in with other's.I was Not on AbcTales no experience,then apart from groups, all 1st base writing group all was free homeless to.
But one can pay enormous amount to print? per time?
I know. Mine used to run off copies, Of mags; for me
as a copier,had them everywhere, A4 paper's, but a book fab: We didn't have a copier machine before.
Have a lovely holiday. And thankyou for all Editor's
help paper work, Editing T.Cook (Tony) and John Wilks. Editor Team. Hope been off help.
cavalcaderl julie xx

Hmmm...

The debate has hardly raged in my absence.

As it stands, at the moment, I could probably count on selling four copies.

Since it's the peak holiday season, I'll keep watching this thread for a few more weeks before deciding on my next course of action.

If there's no further substantial demand, then I'll consider the idea of a stand-alone volume a non-starter.

Perhaps just incorporate some of the pieces in the next issue of the Magazine?

Agree.
Just post some of the pieces in the next issue of the Magazine.

But, dear WBK, in mitigation I assumed that all the "Lets Start Again" entries would have been printed anyway some time in the future.

ps Apologies for raising the topic.

Interesting assumption. Not sure what it's based on.

Don't apologise. It's a reasonable suggestion to make. It's just a pity your enthusiasm isn't shared by the other 17000 members.

Hi All again :) I think like many things, people are interested but with money shortage and busy lives for most, or health a problem some may think it's not possible, but any thing is possible in life and it can happen all just have to want it and believe it, but its easier with more than an handful, I think this could be put on the list of the discussion I started about our work (all writers that are happy for their work to get noticed more) to be put on mugs, t-shirts all sorts, and radio, newspaper, you-tube the list is endless can make this happen. With our commitment and time. If we all pitched in whether it be money, or making the t-shirts, or knowing someone who is in a position to help publicize the site and our work,then it could happen. Like I suggested putting a colage type of a few poems,short stories to start with on you-tube and see what happens, that's the best market research with little leg work and a more up2date way of doing things. Also my other idea is for us to start a Facebook or other site just putting our user name and work by on the page and ABCtales at the top.After all if our work is copyrighted and it helps Abctales and us isn't anything worth a try?.That way busy writers, poor health writers or people that can't afford to much outlay (all of us I suspect now ) :) can have little involvement but see if its worth doing the rest, we could also put a questionnaire up on face book e.t.c and ask people would they buy a mug, t-shirt or anything with ABCtales and the writers work on it.Wilky barkid I am happy to help any time I can :) and It was a good suggestion ScoZen, we had the same idea at the same time sort of lol.

I also thought of giving a percentage of any money made (selling a vast amount that is) to charity depending on market research first.

Keep Writing
Keep Smiling :)

P.s Any one who knows of a vacant position for Fundraiser/Team Leader or Just writes too much position let me know lol. :)

OK: one last chance to see if this is likely to happen.

I briefly re-floated the idea at the 'Upstairs' event and invited feedback.

Who wants to see it available in time for Xmas?

new WilkyBarKid
You read very well.
Great evening.
I am reading this re- mention
invited feedback at the "Wheatsheaf"
Upstairs event, on 21st September.
I do have a hearing aid unfortunately
sat at the back, and had half glass of
wine, but never to me heard much on inviting
for feedback. What was discussed.
Can you let me know we only heard bit mentioned.
Be most greatful. What was said. Please.
julie xx cavalcaderl