Yet Another Depression Thread

FSTE - you're one of my personal all-time comedy greats you are, and you produce work on here that is always fresh, inspiring, well crafted and above all, ridiculously funny. You write with such 'swagger', if you know what I mean. Therefore, I'm gutted to hear you're down at the moment, but if there's one thing I've learnt about FSTE100 since my time here it's that he's a striver, and a doer not just a dreamer, and I sincerely hope you start to feel better soon because you really are a credit to the writing world and deserve to be a happy bunny all the good day long. And as for sleeping all the time, it's bloody cold and dark and I don't blame you. But if it is starting to worry you, get outside in that cold and dark and build a snowman - the biggest, jolliest snowman your road/street/avenue has ever seen - it's hard going but it's worth it and will bring some much needed light into your day I promise you.

Been going through some hard times myself lately but I always find that coming back to ABC and interacting with all the wonderful writers on here (like yourself) lifts the cloud for a short while and nine out of ten times helps me to see through it a little more. Watched a documentary the other night about Steve Jobs that Apple guy and if I remember correctly his little motto was 'keep strong, keep foolish'. Also read one on a beer mat a while ago that said 'there is only one you for all time - fearlessly be yourself' or something like that. I'm not clever enough for inspirational quotes so I've pinched a few and just hope they mean something. Chin up, chest out FSTE, keep writing and take care :)

Rachel xx

FTSE, that sounds like your are in a dark place right now. I don't have any answers, and frankly I don't think that there are any.

You write like a pro - better than that actually.

Your threads and comments to fools and knaves are wise words.

You support when necessary and you tell the truth as you see it.

A very dark time for me was when I spent a long long lime visiting a spinal injuries unit. My best friends son (19 at the time) was the sole survivor out of eight fatalities of a motorway accident. He is a tetraplegic. Those visits contextualised many things for me at the time.

However I am not stupid enough to give you a count your blessings platitude and I don't mean the above to be so superficial. If you are depressed then that is an absolute condition - end of story. Try to hang on to whatever positivism that your psyche maintains contains. Push those things to the fore of your days if you can. A smile from me for what it's worth.

I echo those sentiments above, mate. Sent you a message. Take care.

FTSE, I love your writing but I can see that beyond that, there is an incredibly talented individual. I would be happy to speak with you personally tomorrow afternoon if you need someone to talk to. I am not a counsellor but have had 25 years of talking to people who are feeling low as part of my job and have been through depression myself. If you want to email me on lavadis@aol.com I will take your number and call you after I finish my hearing tomorrow.

Take care of yourself Footsie and remember that however down you feel it will get better. Come Spring and more light and warm weather I am sure you will be on top again. If you can get as much light as possible and go for some walks so you can get some natural serotonin - that would do you good. I know it's not easy- I was there last winter. It's okay to sleep- don't hit yourself on the head for not being able to drag your self out of bed. Sleep as much as you like and don't feel obliged to anyoone or anything. Write as much as you can and tell us how you are feeling. Pamper yourself- get someone to help you with all the menial tasks and chores you can't cope with but make sure you get a good diet. Lots of fruit is good and you will enjoy the taste- that is being good to yourself. Eat what you like but do try to stay healthy- as much as you can cope with. Don't give in to dark thoughts but seek help if it turns nasty. Cry if you want to but don't feel alone- I know the fear too but try to say to yourself that you have nothing to fear- that noone will do you any harm and that they mean well . Talk about your fears and thoughts- get it out of your system whenever it pops up. But most of all don't blame yourself for anything. You are a great guy and I hope this condition blows over soon- very soon. It is terrible feeling the way you do. Yes build a snow man and however you feel remember that we all love you here on Abctales and wish you the best.

Oh I do feel for you in your despair-I wish these words we all have written could help you see a bit brighter on life. It will blow over- mine did but I would never want to be there again..
hugs
;)Pia

I'm not foolish enough to offer anything like advice, but don't be too hard on yourself (that's not advice that's just common sense) and sleep as much as you need to. I hope you feel better.

ftse hold on with your finger nails and start crawling back up from the pit. You WILL make it.

FTSE we all love you and we wish you the best. We are here for you :)

Hi FTSE, I like to think that waves of depression are messages from our inner-self that we need to learn more about how we deal with our lives. The trouble in the past has been that I immediately recognised depression to be a threat rather than a way of growing so it always bit me in the bum and strengthened my turmoil for the next time.
By looking at depression as a way to discover how to better myself, I tried to do things differently to get better results. It works but it needs constant attention. If I let up, it's on me like a rash.
When I decided to give up the sauce and the hash, I knew I only stood a chance of staying stopped if I lived by honesty, open-mindedness and willingness to change. The magic ingredient is doing good things for others and boy do they come back tenfold. The difference to my life is incredible and I can hardly recognise myself from before, but I need to remember where I came from, otherwise I'm only a drink away from being back there.
Live and let live, trying not to judge, acting on the second thought and not the first, treating others the way we'd like to be treated, seeing the good in people, not getting angry over silly things, these are just a few things, but the main thing is doing good. two negatives equalling a positive ends with maths. Acting on our gut feeling means doing the right thing. It seems like the hard way because the easy way requires little of us, but in fact the easy way is always harder in the long run and eventually stops us from living, from being the people we are.
If you drink, try and ask yourself whether it helps or not, whether it really helps or if just blanks things out.
We've had our tiffs in the past but when I asked you to help me recently, you were on it like a flash and I'm massively grateful for that.
You'll see alot of comments from people who value you as a writer on this site. What you do here as a technician is generally taken for granted.
But getting over depression's an inside job and no amount of intelligence or intellectual upper-hand makes it any easier. In fact, it makes it more difficult. No pill or psychotherapist did it for me. It was all about me living on life's terms, and I never wanted to do that because I thought I was so special and different.
The rewards from living a better life are amazing.
As for the drink, I am a binge-drinking alcy. No girlfriend or mate ever told me I was alcoholic because I never drank at home, in the morning and had days off from it, just like the spliff. The thing is that I became aware that it was ruining my life. Sure, circumstances had been bad with a split from my family but all I did was blame and shame. Seeking solace in booze became so destructive that I started losing perspective and my relationship became even more strained. With money difficulties, everything became a blur and I could see no way out.
Thankfully, I asked for help and got it in AA. Life is completely different now. I love waking up and doing as much as I can. Nothing seems insurmountable whereas a pen dropping to the floor would piss me off and see me down the pub before. I looked for reasons to have a drink, any reason would do.
If you don't have a drink problem, then the same rules apply. Think positive and do good things for others. Try it. I guarantee it will work if you work it.
Much respect for posting this topic so honestly. It all starts by asking for help and listening to what our gut says.
All the best
Richard

This is all getting so damn silly. I'm even afraid to add to this thread in case I say the wrong thing.

Thank you all for your understanding and support. Imagine if I'd posted this and nobody had replied!

My problems aren't the result of heroin and drugs. It makes as much sense to say that as alcohol and drugs - why single one of them out for a special mention? But I suppose alcohol is the worst, partly because people are taught to believe that it isn't a 'real' drug and so feel it must be safe. If you find out your kids have been taking MDMA, just be thankful it wasn't vodka.

None of my family have ever been great alcohol enthusiasts. I used to enjoy LSD when I was a student, but that was a long time ago. Hash used to make me anxious and uncomfortable. Even heroin didn't do much for me on the couple of occasions I tried it. On the whole my lifetime's 'substance' consumption has been very modest. I'm not sure whether to be pleased that my body chemistry seems to be anti-addictive or sad that I have never experienced the full pleasures of the booze, but I think I'll settle for what I've got.

Depression, for want of a better word, has been a factor in my life for as long as I can remember. It never goes away. Sometimes it's worse than others, but the general trend is downwards, and that worries me no end.

One by one all the things I used to enjoy have dropped away. The first time in my life that I had a bit of money I bought myself a piano. Now it has dust on it thick enough to write my name in. Play the piano or do the washing up? There's nothing to choose between them any more in terms of pleasure, and the washing up is more useful, so whenever I can I do that.

Now I find myself afraid to do anything on ABC, on the technical side. I'm overcome by fear that anything I do will go wrong and that I'll break the site and destroy it forever. I know it's bollocks, my intellect is still intact, but irrational fear is just as scary as the rational stuff. And you can't talk yourself out of it, as anybody who's afraid of flying or spiders or whatever will tell you. If you're afraid, you're afraid.

How pathetic is that? I really am fed up with myself.

Short of as miracle, I am never going to be 'cured'. All I can do is hope that things don't get any worse. Even that seems unreasonably optimistic.

The one thing I can still do is write. As soon as I start writing, the 'me' that seems buried under an avalanche of fear suddenly comes to the surface and starts talking. If that ever stops I don't know what I'll do.

I hope you don't mind if I don't respond to all your posts individually, I have a snowman to build. :)

Your support means a lot to me, and I offer my support in turn to anybody who is going through hard times themselves.

God bless you all.

Paul

Dear Paul
having this long term condition as you say you have I must say you impress me with your creativity and the fact that you manage the site so well despite. Well done!
I wish we/someone could take your fear from you and I really would wish that this depression was a passing state for you as it was for me.
Keep writing !!

all the best
;)Pia

Thank you Pia. I'll still keep doing as much as I can on the site. Some things are easier than others. Spammers - just let me at them!

Much joy,
Paul

The good thing about a depression thread is nobody ever gets depressed reading it.

These responses speak for themself, FTSE. You have made so many people happy with your writing and your wonderful work on this site. I sort of understand what you're going through as I lost my wife in a car crash, some eight years ago. I was almost a recluse for a few months before my friends dragged me down to the pub. I have now met someone else, but still recall that harrowing time. Writing is our ally in such times, a way of expressing our true feelings. Chin up, friend, and give that piano of yours a tinkle.

Hey Paul *shouts into a tin can attached to a piece of string* If you come out of your emotional Anderson shelter, I'll come out of mine for a spot of tiffin on the ABC lawn. So it's cold...wear a thermal vest. See you soon.x

I'm sorry to hear about your black dog, Footsie. I have to say I found all this very surprising indeed, bearing in mind how jolly and flippant and facetious you normally are.

I know exactly what you mean about not getting pleasure out of things anymore. This seems to be a natural part of getting older. When you're young you feel as though everything is magical and that life has some kind of mystical significance, and then gradually you come to feel as though the planet Earth is a rather pointless little rock floating in space. And you stop giving a shit.

However, there are things in life that can make this realisation a lot less painful, for example, love, friendship and art.

It's funny that you mention drugs and your apparent imperviousness to them. I used to be totally indifferent to drugs, until I started taking a particular one that did a lot to help me recover from my own depression.

The substance in question is not one that you've mentioned. It is one of the least addictive drugs you can take. And many doctors, psychiatrists and suchlike folk are now saying that it is potentially very good indeed for treating depression and other mental health problems. It's normally used by veterinary surgeons. (And people from Bristol).

The drug gave me a deep sense of the profound meaningfulness and beauty of the universe, and of being alive. And now I don't need it anymore.

I'd be lying though, if I said that it was the only thing that pulled me out of the black cloud I'd been slouching around in for the larger part of twenty years, stretching back to when I was first bullied at school at the age of eleven. Other things helped too, such as finding the love of a good woman for the first time in my life, and finding some amazing friends instead of the absolute wank-buckets I'd been hanging around with previously.

Know who your true friends are, and grasp onto them.

Even on a website where you are surrounded by people you've never even met, there are people who genuinely care about you. Nobody is making snide remarks about your suffering. I wish the same had been true for me when, a couple of years ago, I came onto this site and told everyone what had happened to me to knock me into the worst depressive slump of my life and make me want to pick up a gun and wipe out as many human beings (especially middle-class ones) as possible:

http://abctales.com/forum/2009/02/16/why-i-find-it-so-difficult

Do you remember that? Most of the people on that thread had some human empathy in them, but a certain few were just utter arseholes. Because there are always going to be utter arseholes, no matter how clearly you prove that they are utter arseholes. According to such people, I don't deserve love and I need to blame myself and get over myself and grow up and blah blah blah. You have to try not to worry about cretins like this. They are just abortions that lived.

That was a couple of years ago now, mind. I'm a lot happier and healthier now. I've been free from depression for over a year now. So you can free yourself from it too.

Security guard: “What the hell kind of clown are you?”
Bill Murray: “The crying on the inside kind, I guess.”

- Quick Change -

Thanks for taking the trouble to respond, Mac. I don't normally try to explain myself, but having put myself in the spotlight I suppose I have no choice.

Suppose that all the best things that you can possibly imagine happened to you. You meet the perfect woman. The middle classes all die of taramasalata poisoning. Everybody thinks Face Transplant is the best thing since sliced Beatles. A lottery win? It's yours if you want it. Everybody loves you.

Imagine that all that happened and you still felt as bad as before. Then what would you do?

That's depression. If nothing makes a difference to you, where's your motivation to do anything? I could try to flog my writing, but having a newspaper column or a book deal wouldn't make me feel any different, except that I'd be anxious about not being able to meet other people's expectations. So I've never sent it to anybody.

If you feel nothing yourself, it's sometimes hard to remember that other people do have feelings. You have to keep reminding yourself. I can't remember what it was like to feel anything positive.

Should I really be telling people this?

Out of curiosity, which drug? BZP? It seems to fit the bill. It was originally used to worm horses, I believe, and was once considered for use as an anti-depressant. I wonder who was the first human being to try it? Mmmm, that horse-worming pill looks delicious, I'll give it a go!

The BZP/TFMPP combination is a poor man's substitute for MDMA. Been there, done that!

The trouble with the BZP experience, at least for me, is that it's fine while it lasts but you don't bring anything back from it. And you rapidly build up a tolerance to it, one of the reasons it isn't used as an anti-depressant. You have to take ever increasing doses to get the same effect.

Of course, you might be talking about something entirely different!

my hubby suffers with bad depressions, it sometimes lingers over into my own life, i have no words of wisdom or any of real comfort, but just know your not own your own, their are alot of people on here that care about you, and just try to write thats what helps me, take care xx

Thank you for your replies everybody. I'll gladly talk to you on the string telephone, Lena, but I don't know your number. Three twangs on the string is mine.

Paul

Lavadis said something interesting about anti-deps recently; that while they can't reslove the core-issues, they can help to get perspective back. That sounds like a good idea to me. I tried them for six weeks and didn't like the feeling I was on 'drugs'. I had a nasty experience in Italy at a fancy dress party and I was more feared up than I've ever been, hence the end of anti-deps for me.
this may scare you to death or make you laugh but the thing that helps me more than anything else is God or a higher power. You may be a complete agnostic/atheist but that doesn't matter.
I think you're experiencing an emotional/spiritual rock-bottom. Perhaps you have always relied on your own instincts/intellect and see that it's all for nothing, meaningless in the grand scheme of things. everything seems samey, a waste of time and fear that life's over presides our every waking moment. Nothing seems to be able to take it away.
The thing I find so heartening is that such a headstrong and seemingly resilient human being such as yourself has now, in desperation, asked for help.
This is a massive step and can point the way to a better perspective. It means that finally your mind is open and willing to new ways of thinking. You've run your way ragged and found yourself staring at a piano that seems to mean nothing any more.
It does mean something. It's just that you've lost its value.
It's a symbol of your life.
The thing with asking for help from human beings is that we're naturally faulty and selfish.
With the best intentions, we can only help you see where you need to change.
The real work has to come from you. The desire to change is strengthened by the depth of desperation you have come to. To find meaning and enlightenment is paramount and that may mean looking outside of yourself and other human beings.
By giving away your will to a higher power, the universe, air, God, whatever you want to call it, means that you have accepted that your way doesn't work, that your life has become unmanageable.
Like all human beings, I have to say I'm in a rush now and I've got to go, but give it some thought.
Let go and let God. It could be the bravest step you ever took.
Richard

BZP?

No, I've never even heard of that.

I was talking about ketamine.

If someone is prone to depression, I think it's always going to be worse at this time of year. It's a well-known fact that Samaritans are at their busiest over Christmas and New Year.

Another thing that struck me when I first read your post was that the people on here who write the most humorous pieces are invariably depressives - I won't go into theories about that, no need, it's pretty obvious really. I also think, know in fact, that all creative people have a tendency to depression.

Anyway, nuff said - keep writing, Paul.

FTSE, I'm sorry to hear that you're feeling pants. I also agree with the thought that the fact you've spoken up about what you're going through is a pretty major hint at the strength you hold inside. You will need ginormous balls of steel for the next bit and for a fair few other bits in the future - recovery is not for the faint hearted but never believe it is impossible. I echo the sentiments above that say that depression can define you in a positive way - your empathy for others will grow and your tolerance for bullshit (including any borne from yourself) will shrink. What's not to love there?

Great music helps. As do SSRI antidepressants, IMO, they give you space to allow the lights to come back on while you figure out what step to take next. Laughing loudly and keeping going through the motions of life in some way also keeps you attached and fighting.

Looking forward to reading your next piece and chortling at your middle class taramasalata comment :)))

I just thought I'd say a bit more, about what blighters said, regarding "a higher power, the universe, air, God, whatever you want to call it".

For years I had no spiritual faith of any kind. As far as I was concerned, there was no evidence whatsoever of any kind of higher power.

Then I took ketamine. I changed my mind.

Naff as it sounds - AA-speak as it sounds - I'm full of identification with you, Footsie. I've travelled that country, and haven't really ever left. Giving up booze helped a lot, though. Enabled me to do without ADs, anyway. It was just masking symptoms that I'm only now beginning to understand and address. As someone said to me 'It's taken you most of your life to get this sick, so it's going to take a fair while to get better again.' Two years so far, and counting...

blighters, Mac, I think the God issue is something I'd rather steer clear of here. I'd love to believe there was some point to all this. It's such a waste if you spend a lifetime learning how to do things right, and then it all vanishes when you die. You certainly can't pass the benefits of your experience on to others, as anyone with kids will tell you, everybody has to learn it the hard way. Then, just when you're starting to get the hang of it, out go the lights. So yes, I really want there to be a purpose to it all.

But wanting a thing doesn't make it true.

Shit FTSE now you tell me wanting a thing doesn't make it true!

It's yer basic theology, mate. Justification by faith. If you believe hard enough, it will all be true. But I don't, so it ain't.

I know exactly what you mean Footsie- I can't seem to believe hard enough either- I wonder how some do it? The truth for me is in tiny things, small achievments every day. It's really important to notice those. At the moment I am reading Walt Whitman- Leaves of Grass and just understanding all he writes and taking it aboard is a great achievment for me- it's food for the mind and soul. You get lost in a spiritual, mind expanding universe reading these masters. Will try som E. A. Poe as well- there are so many I have to catch up on after wasting my youth on drugs and doing fuck-all- just plain out of touch. It's so exiting waking up to the world and realizing it is still turning.

Keep writing

atb
;)Pia

Hi Pia, what are you doing up at this time of the morning?

I'll have to try reading again too. The only thing I've read recently is Queen Camilla and that's not very mind-expanding at all! It is funny, though.

I forgot to say that you must remember to pat yourself on the head/shoulder everytime you have done something you thought you couldn't cope with- sorry I keep coming back- think I will stop all this "good advice".

I'm usually early up Footsie and sometimes at ungodly hours- I like the time I get to myself at that time and incidentally don't sleep too well unfortunately. I could ask you the same, eh!
Funny jiggles around the brain cells in a happy way!

Keep on truckin' Footsie
see you next year.. hehe
watch out with those firecrackers !!!

I had to find faith because I was almost certainly going to die very quickly without it. I'm grateful to alcohol and drugs for taking me all the way down the pit but only because that desperation gave me faith in a higher power that could guide me.
I used to envy people who didn't need faith of any sort other than themselves but that's all changed now. I used to defy any talk of God just like you but I knew all along I was kidding (and hurting) myself. I feel like one of the luckiest people on the planet now. It's not always like this but I can take happiness now without thinking it to be an excuse to get properly wasted.
I think desperation's a gift but if you don't get low enough in spirit, then it may not be necessary to search for faith. If I knew now that it could help me in all ways, I'd have looked anyway but I may not have been able to find it.
Like I said, i'm not a 'proper' alcoholic. I never drank at home (unless with company), in the morning, never got the shakes. I was never physically or menatlly addicted to it. It is a spiritual sickness that made me drink, a feeling that I wasn't comfortable in my own skin.
Tradition Three says 'the only requirement for membership is a desire to stop drinking', so when I feel like a fake and some members talk of their rock bottom, all I have to do is refer to Tradition Three.
I hope that makes some sense as to my reasons for searching so desperately for faith in a higher power.
Personally, I think you're far too intelligent (perhaps for your own good) not to see that there is something outside of humanity that runs the show. British Rail can't even operate with leaves on the line so how on earth does the sun come up and the seasons turn like clockwork? Who or what does that? Having faith is like expecting the sun to come up in the morning. It's natural, and reliable every single day.

Hope you're doing better FTSE100. Thanks for sharing with us how you were feeling. I see the others were real supportive. I'm just getting back into the swing of how all this feels so here's hoping you're up to having me back!