'Finnegans Wake' by James Joyce

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Sun, 2002-03-31 19:31

Try and read this man:

" riverrun, past Eve and Adam's, from swerve of shore to bend of bay, brings us by a commodius vicus of recirculation back to Howth Castle and Environs.
Sir Tristam, violer d'amores, fr'over the short sea, had passencore rearrived from North Armorica on this side the scraggy isthmus of Europe Minor to wielderfight his penisolate war: nor had topsawyer's rocks by the stream Oconee exaggerated themselse to Laurens County's gorgios while they went doublin their mumper all the time: nor avoice from afire bellowsed mishe mishe to tauftauf thuartpeatrick: not yet, though venisoon after, had a kidscad buttended a bland old isaac: not yet, though all's fair in vanessy, were sosie sesthers wroth with twone nathandjoe. Rot a peck of pa's malt had Jhem or Shen brewed by arclight and rory end to the regginbrow was to be seen ringsome on the aquaface.
The fall (bababadalgharaghtakamminarronnkonnbronntonnerronntuonnthunntrovarrhounawnskawntoohoohoordenenthurnuk!) of a once wallstrait oldparr is retaled early in bed and later on life down through all christian minstrelsy. The great fall of the offwall entailed at such short notice the pftjschute of Finnegan, erse solid man, that the humptyhillhead of humself prumptly sends an unenquiring one well to the west in quest of his tumptytumtoes: and their upturnpikepointandplace is at the knock out in the park where oranges have been laid to rust upon the green since devlinsfirst loved livvy."

-first page of Finnegans wake by James Joyce-

According to my friend who somehow has managed to memorise that entire first page, the first page sums up the whole book.

James Joyce said he thought about every word: that no word was wasted, he didn't write anything just for the hell of it, he thought about it all. He used something like 75 different languages in the book, and used a technique called cut and paste. Which William Burroughs also used, so I wonder if William Burroughs was inspired by James Joyce.

Apparently James Joyce had to write the last part of the book on a blackboard as he was losing his eyesight.

I also noticed that the very first word on this page is also a title for one of S.P. Somtow's books - 'Riverrun' so I wonder if S.P. Somtow's book is connected with Finnegan's Wake in some way.

And the initials: H.C.E appear frequently in the book, the first time they appear is at the end of the very first sentence: Howth Castle and Environs.

It's an interesting book anyway, not easy to read at all. But I'am gonna check it out, try and read it. As I think if I can read the whole thing through; I might learn something.

Has anyone else read it? If so what did you think to it?

Sun, 2002-03-31 20:17

Andrea

Funky, you got so excited, you messed up the thread!

Sun, 2002-03-31 22:19

desk_clerk

I've read about 60 pages of Finnegans Wake, and it's probably one of the best things I've read. I think it's great! Total gibberish and completely incomprehensible, but fantastic! Joyce intended 'Wake' to be a dream, so the way it is written is meant to be reminiscent of 'dream language' ie something that you can't really comprehend, something beyond us. I found it a massive influence on how I write and encouraged me to be more experimental and mess about with language and words. Good luck with it, hope you get further than me! Callum

Mon, 2002-04-01 00:34

justyn_thyme

Burroughs got the idea for "cut up" writing from his painter friend Brion Geysin. His didn't use all of the results. It was just a way of re-arranging words and sentence fragments to see what would happen. If it sounded interesting, he would keep the result, if not he would either throw it out or alter it. It's a bit like some of the stream of consciousness writing I've seen. I vaguely recall some passages in Dos Passos books.

Mon, 2002-04-01 14:12

Peter Kalve

Incidentally, it has been suggested by others that Finnegan was the archetypal Osirus, the progenitor, who, by virtue of a form of (highly sexual) resurrection, fathered the people of the world. H.C.E. becomes "Haveth Childer Everywhere". The last sentence of Finnegans Wake continues this theme of cyclical regeneration, the words "A way a lone a last a loved a long the" which end the book acting as the first (missing)words of the opening sentence of the book which continue "riverrun, past Eve and Adam's..." Finally, Finnegan's name is a play on words: Finn (fin=end) egan (again=rebirth). Clever stuff.

Tue, 2002-04-02 20:33

James Davies

Never read it but have read Ulysses which is weird incomprehensible but a remarkable acheivement-as for your comments they have inspired me to return to Joyce!!

Wed, 2002-04-03 03:27

wick

both ulysses and finnegans wake are over analysed to shreds. joyce was not well read enough to have packed in all the references to which these writings are attibuted, and in any surreal passages you can add meaning where there was really none. finnegan is traditionally the name of an elderly figure in one of joyce's earlier haunts

Wed, 2002-04-03 07:53

Peter Kalve

Er..that's it! The fact he included the name of every river in Tibet in the book has nothing to do with being well-read, but pure, unadulterated coincidence. "Joyce the Unlettered", discuss. Now there's a thought...

Wed, 2002-04-03 23:18

andrew pack

I've never attempted Finnegans Wake, but I do like Ulysses a lot. It is better second time around when you realise that the best thing to do with the Oxen in the Sun chapter it just to skip it. You might want to try "The Waves" by Virginia Woolf, Funky. Very stylised though understandable language, but everything that is usually a constant in novels disappears and it is a book that you simply can't read at breakneck pace - if you read it quickly, you will lose all sense of location and character, but if you read it line by line, at the pace you read poetry, it all comes together. Of course scholars try to read a lot into books and seek meaning where there probably isn't any - I've read a very odd essay saying that Joyce appears as a character in Ulysses, as the man who wins the cycle race, but I don't think it can really be doubted that Joyce was trying to pack a lot into the book and spent a long time assembling it. I've not read any Dos Passos Justyn - can you recommend a good starting-point?

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