and another bloody thing as well

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Fri, 2004-01-23 21:23

Lib Dem MP Sacked Over
'Suicide Bomber' Remarks

LIBERAL Democrat MP Jenny Tonge has been sacked from the party's frontbench for saying she could understand why some Palestinians became suicide bombers.

Dr Tonge had repeatedly said she understood why militant Palestinians were driven to carry out the attacks in the face of the brutality of the Israeli occupation.

And she insisted that living in the Middle East could have driven her to do the same.

Lib Dem leader Charles Kennedy said he had now asked her to stand down as the party's spokeswoman for children.

"Her recent remarks about suicide bombers are completely unacceptable,'' Mr Kennedy said in a statement.

"They are not compatible with Liberal Democrat party policies and principles. There can be no justification, under any circumstances for taking innocent lives through terrorism.''

Dr Tonge, MP for Richmond Park, defended her comments.

"I was just trying to say how, having seen the violence, humiliation and provocation Palestinians live under every day, and have done now for decades, I could understand, I was trying to understand, where they come from," she said.

"If I had been a mother and a grandmother in Palestine living for decades in that situation, I don't know, I may very well have become one myself.

"That doesn't mean to say I condone suicide bombers, I don't."

Mr Kennedy had been under predictable and mounting pressure from pro-Israeli groups to act. But attempts to distance the party from her views did not satisfy them.

Labour's Louise Ellman, vice-chair of the all-party British-Israeli parliamentary group and an executive member of the Labour Friends of Israel, said: "Charles Kennedy has taken the right action.

"It recognises that her statement was irresponsible and gave the green light to terrorism.''

Lord Janner, also a vice-chair of the British-Israeli parliamentary group, said: "The decision of the Liberal Democrats to sack Jenny Tonge is admiral and appropriate."

So whats wrong with what she said??? Are we not supposed to try and understnd how other nations/people feel then? Grrr.

Fri, 2004-01-23 21:26

mississippi

Nothing wrong with it at all my dear, or what RKS said as it happens. Calm down now or you'll bust yer elastic!

Fri, 2004-01-23 21:31

Liana

No.. I dont feel like being calm. I am really appalled that a person - govt minister or not, cant express a sympathy for how someone might be feeling. Anyone with half a brain can see that she wasnt condoning terrorism... oh, mind you, we are talking about Charles Kennedy here... silly me. I wouldve thought that encouraging people to have empathy would count for something. Guess not. *twangs elastic at Missi*

Fri, 2004-01-23 21:33

mississippi

So how about we give her AND RKS their jobs back?

Fri, 2004-01-23 21:34

Liana

No RKS cant have his, he's too oily, and the gardening programme is infinitely better than his smarms to camera.

Fri, 2004-01-23 22:04

mississippi

Sorry then, the libdem tart better find another job too.

Fri, 2004-01-23 22:07

justyn_thyme

I was about to say that RKS doesn't work for the government, but I suppose that is technically not true, depending upon how one views BBC. Kennedy could have made much more political capital out of letting her stay on, but publically disavowing her opinon. That way, he could have distanced himself and the party from her while at the same time making hay from allowing the free an open discussion of all opinions in the great Lib Dem party. In short, he blew an opportunity to pull a very sophisticated weasel deal.

Fri, 2004-01-23 22:10

mississippi

He's probably spent all day in the subsidised bar James. He doesn't think too clearly after a hard day at the scotch.

Fri, 2004-01-23 22:15

Liana

Apparently he bowed to pressure from the Isrealis. Surely not...

Fri, 2004-01-23 22:18

#10

Ros Lloyd

Fancy a glass of SA shiraz, Liana? £3 a bottle off in Sainsburyberry's this week? Works wonders for those Grrrr! moments! Be very quick if you do, 'cos there's not much left here... hic!

Fri, 2004-01-23 22:25

#11

Liana

I am drinking slivovice comrade, but thanks for the offer!!

Fri, 2004-01-23 22:25

#12

jude

Dr Tonge ...what was she thinking? If I were her I'd do anything to keep such a silly name out of the media. Is it pronounced like Tongue or to rhyme with Blamanche?

Fri, 2004-01-23 22:41

#13

mississippi

I think it rhymes with bungie, Jude.

Sat, 2004-01-24 00:19

#14

d.beswetherick

On the face of it, no, she shouldn't lose her job with the Liberals, particularly as she was shadowing on children's issues. But it falls to someone to say that you have to watch your words in matters like this in case you are interpreted as justifying suicide bombing. Can Tonge distinguish between understanding why a Palestinian might suicide bomb and an al Quaeda person doing thesame thing? I imagine that Tonge is making the headlines on both sides of the conflict in Palestine and being thoroughly misinterpreted.

Sat, 2004-01-24 08:08

#15

Liana

It was clear that she was not condoning terrorism... for the media to keep insisting that that was her intent is ridiculous. I just feel really despondent bout it... it depresses me that someone who really has very little power, lets face it, can be leapt on and treated so badly, for trying to empathise with people. Gruesome.

Sat, 2004-01-24 15:07

#16

Jamie (Schembri)

I avoid the news and politics whenever possible (though I'm advised that writers should not do so) because of the grrrr syndrome. I don't condone suicide bombers in the slightest but I do try to imagine where they are coming from. You would have to really hold a deep seated belief in something or be consumed by terror to actually blow yourself to pieces for any cause. Aren't suicide bombers encouraged to do so by their country's leaders? Do they have much choice regarding their actions? I look at this subject the same as I do that of Holy Wars. God tells the leaders to force their country to attack another... apparently! Then we become outraged when innocent people die. We would never allow that sort of thing to happen here, would we? When our leaders decide to have a war are we all able to sit back and refuse to have anything to do with it? I had a friend die in the recent war...his family feel that the government used him as no more than a bonifide suicide bomber. We dont have to agree with the views of another nation to be able to relate to them...that is unless our government feels the beliefs held in this country are superior. Not making much sense I know, but there is a point I'm trying to make in there somewhere.

Sat, 2004-01-24 16:04

#17

mississippi

I read that one of last weeks SB'ers was a young woman who had apparently been caught playing away. She was told she could either die in disgrace at the hands of her family, or die a hero in the service of her disgusting masters. Any nation/religion that kills it's own people for following their hearts/hopes/dreams deserves to rot in hell. I have yet to learn of a single thing about these people that makes me believe they are decent.

Sat, 2004-01-24 16:50

#18

Polish Mark

It's not just a religious thing. The Al Aqsa Martyrs Brigades is a secular Palestinian movement who also carry out suicide bombings - but not in the name of Allah. There is no evidence to show that these people are coereced into blowing themselves up - the tragedy is that young people are literally queuing up for the opportunity of martyrdom. The difference between Jenny Tonge and RKS is that Tonge's comments were measured, balanced and rational, whereas RKS was hysterical, racially prejudiced and factually incorrect.

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